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  • Salvis induction rewire from 230V to 400V

     okwestern updated 4 months, 1 week ago 3 Members · 13 Posts
  • okwestern

    Member
    May 13, 2020 at 6:59 am

    Hello! We have a Salvis aki1 (dual induction, 230V, 10kW). We’re moving and have only 400V. Is it possible to rewire this?

  • ectofix

    Member
    May 13, 2020 at 8:18 am

    I have over forty years of experience repairing electrical equipment and over twenty of those repairing virtually everything in a commercial kitchen. Even still, I haven’t ever repaired induction cooking and warming equipment. WHY? Because every manufacturer of those will tell you to send it to THEM. They’ll offer NO tech support, NO schematic and NO part support.

    I get that because there’s simply too much going on in there that is NOT field serviceable.

    In one of your photos is the unit’s specification sticker. On it states that its electrical power source should be 230v, 50Hz, 3phase and capable of a 10kw load.

    That’s it. That’s how that unit is listed and how it was certified. Attempting to change any of that will negate its certification and may also make it a safety hazard.

    SO…NO. The unit cannot be rewired for 400v.

    I suggest you contact Salvis for further clarification:

    Contact Salvis

  • okwestern

    Member
    May 13, 2020 at 8:53 am

    Hi Ectofix. I agree…. but for example the Bear Varimixer also states the same, 230V printed on the name plate, but internally it can be rewired to 400V (and I did and it runs beautifully). Of course, only being a motor, this was a simple delta/star modification.

    • ectofix

      Member
      May 13, 2020 at 10:22 am

      Right. That and possibly a main transformer in the mixer that’d need to be restrapped.

      ——————–

      With that 50Hz rating, you’re obviously not in the U.S. or Canada. I don’t have any experience with 230v line-to-neutral sources in Europe and elsewhere, so had to look that up and think about it.

      SO, where you’re at, what is your SINGLE PHASE voltage rated at?

    • ectofix

      Member
      May 13, 2020 at 10:26 am

      I’m guessing it’s 230v.

      You said the NEW place only has 400v. Why don’t you just have an electrician run you a neutral? Then you’ll have your 230v (line-to-neutral) AND the 400v phase-to-phase…which is probably what you have NOW.

      • fixbear

        Member
        May 13, 2020 at 11:15 am

        Ecto, he’s in Norway. I remember the Gelato machine post he had. You’ll be interested in that he also has a Rational SCC202.

        • ectofix

          Member
          May 13, 2020 at 11:35 am

          So Norway is 230v single phase, but also can provide 230v THREE PHASE?

          Well then. That’s over MY head. Why did Norway do that?

          Anyway…that explains why the data sticker on that unit.

  • fixbear

    Member
    May 13, 2020 at 12:24 pm

    Salvis is also big on modular installations that they build custom to each kitchen. The are especially liked for front line and food truck operations in Europe. They even make a mobile cooking center for table side work that has it’s own air filtration system that hold’s two modules..

  • okwestern

    Member
    May 13, 2020 at 12:43 pm

    Yes, fixbear you’re right, I’m in Norway. In Norway we have 230V single phase, 230V three phase and 400V three phase and neutral. Previously also 380V. We have both IT (french <i style=”font-family: inherit; font-size: inherit;”>Isolée Terre) and TN (Terra Neutral) nets, but the standard now is TN 400V. Much of the 230V 3P equipment in circulation was delivered on special order due to the old standard in older buildings.

    Our new location has 400V three phase + neutral. I now I can get 230V between neutral and any of the phases in a 400V system, but I’m not sure how to supply 230V 3P equipment . Do I wire one of the 230V 3P wires to the 400V N wire? How do I know which one? Since two of the phases will still see 400V between them.

    • ectofix

      Member
      May 13, 2020 at 4:13 pm

      Much of the 230V 3P equipment in circulation was delivered on special order due to the old standard in older buildings.

      Our new location has 400V three phase + neutral. I now I can get 230V between neutral and any of the phases in a 400V system, but I’m not sure how to supply 230V 3P equipment . Do I wire one of the 230V 3P wires to the 400V N wire? How do I know which one? Since two of the phases will still see 400V between them.

      SO. Once again. Your OLD location is supplied 230v, 3 phase while your NEW location will be 400v, 3 phase? Right?

      Forget what I said earlier about a neutral. I wasn’t aware of the double standard regarding your three-phase sources.

      That being as it may, I’m back to square ONE on my statement regarding your 230v, 3phase induction cooking unit. There isn’t ANY rewiring that can be done to adapt it straight over to 400v, 3phase. You’d have to change parts in it to make it work. The transformer for sure, but maybe some other stuff.

      Can’t advise any further through pictures of wires you posted and no schematic. I’d have to see it myself on the bench in order to study it.

      • fixbear

        Member
        May 13, 2020 at 5:17 pm

        sounds like a good road trip. I’m ready.

  • okwestern

    Member
    May 13, 2020 at 5:46 pm

    <div>Old location was 230V 3P/E, new is 400V 3PN/E. I dismantled it, and found that the line filter is rated 230/400V so it is ok, transformer is rated 208V but this only powers the logic and doesn’t use many watts (so I can introduce neutral wire to the machine, and hook the transformer between P-N (phase and neutral) to obtain 230V). That also takes care of all logic boards. Next is the contactor. I can’t see the coil, but it’s probably 230V (can be hooked to P-N, or it’s also cheap to replace it with 400V coil). Then comes the POWERSEM PSD 62/16 three-phase bridge rectifier rated at 1600V, so no problem there. The board mounted to the bridge rectifier has a 400V sticker on it (see picture). The on-board relay has a 24V coil, but I can’t read the contact rating. It looks like a Schrack RE030024, which is a 300V relay. I can’t read the varistors (blue discs). The recified voltage are smoothed (filtered) over three 3uF on-board capacitors which are rated 400V, so they will be too small (I think RMS is square root of 2 multiplied with the voltage -> 1.41 x 400V = 564V, so the caps must be larger – if I understand it correctly). The smoothed voltage goes to another larger board, which is cooled with a huge heat sink. The board sticker reads “Print 2×3.5/5kW/208V”. I didn’t disassemble this board, but this goes directly into the dual induction coils (which has no info, probably 230V rated wire coils). I don’t know if Salvis distinguishes between 230 and 400V coil.</div><div>It is possible to use only one phase and neutral (gives 230V)? Will this give half the effect (5kW) to the cooking plates (since the bridge rectifier only outputs each second wave, equal to a 50% duty cycle)?</div><div>Any thoughts of modifying this to run at 400V with full effect?</div>

  • okwestern

    Member
    May 24, 2020 at 3:02 am

    Bump 🙂 Any ideas?

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