Imports

[rico]

Good luck on that “meeting”. Let me know how it turns out.

 

I’ve never seen the older Rats your talking about I went to their four day school  in Schamburg a few years ago. At that time they had just come out with the care control units. Where I am at now we have the model(s) just prior to care control. We use conditioned water for scale control but still descale every three months. With as many units that you have, how do you handle the descale? It would seem that you would almost need a full time tech just for that!

 

Paul

[ectofix]

Here’s an excerpt of a little graphic I made for the guys at work.  Kind of a derivative of what’s in the training manual, but I tailored this to just the ovens we do have. We don’t have any of the earlier “classic-line” Rationals:

 

I made up what the “CCD” and “CCC” stand for, because I couldn’t find that information anywhere.  The C-lines use a mind-boggling array of contactors to facilitate blower and heat control functions.  Failure of those (from pitting) is their biggest design weakness.  Our 480 volt units amplify that in a resounding fashion when they go…BOOM!

 

Referencing your question on descaling them – we have three shifts and each tech is assigned their own list of equipment to PM.  We do quarterly PMs on the Rationals.

 

The SCC units with the CareControl feature rarely require doing an actual descaling procedure.  I’ve observed and monitored this very closely on the newer SCCs, and those little pellets in the blue bag DO work.  However, they’re citric acid-based and won’t put a dent in any significant scale buildup.  Therefore I’ve hounded my co-workers to do CareControl cycles as often as possible. It’s a great labor-saving feature, but MUST be done often.  Otherwise the serious hydrochloric acid-based stuff must be used.

 

When that occasion arises (and for ovens w/o CareControl), Rational’s descale pump (http://is.shotfarm.com/viewer/index.html?p=5716_80685_23413673) gets used to put the descaler into the boilers through the steam port inside the cooking compartment.  So long as the emptying (self-cleaning) pump on the boiler is in working condition and not clogged, that is the way we delime them.  It only takes a few hours each.

 

Apologies to all for hijacking the thread.  I’ll stop now.

[rico]

Its all good info, so don’t worry. Or, you could pm me….I think. When I was in class they said that even with care control, you would have to do some manual descaling. I have a pump but its such a pain to use, I stopped. I empty the boiler first. I pull the drain pump hose off where it goes into the cavity. Put a funnel in the end of the hose and pour the stuff in. Re attach the hose and over-fill the boiler with the fill control.

Fortunately for me, all my stuff is gas/208v. When I was in the field, I always ran into the 480v units with the solid state relays. I was lucky enough to never have one go boom but the customers would tell me about it. Kinda like the early IR Frymasters with an air leak.

The chart wouldn’t open for me but I think it’s the security they have here. I can’t even upload pics without calling IT first. Casino mentality. Thanks anyway.

Paul

[ectofix]

Okay…one more about Rational.

 

Never had a 480v Rational go “BOOM!” with the SSRs, but there’s always a first time…so they say.

 

Nope, mechanical contactors are the ones that give it up.  Carbon build-up forms from repeated and frequent cycling, then the pitting forms, some resistance builds up, etc.  Next thing you know the 480vac potential goes to the contact right next door to get home.  Then, BOOM!  That usually takes out several other contactors just to make the 480vac happy.

 

I’ve only seen SSRs fail closed.  Symptoms there are that the unit, whatever type of unit it is, overtemps and burns food.  I do like a SSR’s overall clean and streamlined function, but the manufacturers who use them sure are proud of their replacements.

 

I like your idea of pouring the descaler down the drain pump hose.  The only other avenues on these Rationals are by pouring descaler into the probe port, using the pump, or by removing the boiler altogether for some special setup on a bench using Ferncos and such to enclose and descale it.

 

I’m very leery of of anyone pouring anything into those boilers (or into hoses to them) while in the unit because of potential spillage of acid onto the solenoid valves, the cleanjet pump, the big-ole-donut-looking transformers on some…or whatever.  I personally would be taking some over-the-top and resourceful precautions to prevent that, but I’m not certain everyone else would.

 

I’ve descaled all types of steamers and I know it takes some special awareness and understanding to properly and harmlessly do that seemingly mundane task.  Not all of my co-workers have been there yet, so that’s why I advise them to go with the manual’s recommendations…or variations thereof, for putting the descaler in.

 

Another unique circumstance for us is that our populous row of floor-model 202 units are abreast of each other by mere inches.  A pallet jack, two guys and some disconnecting of the electric/drain/water connections are necessary just to take the side panels off to pour descaler in.    It ain’t right, but that’s the way it is.  We rarely have two guys to just THAT as it is.  So I ultimately advise them that descaling the unit and putting it back into service should be done with a pump…to avoid any harm to those internal components in that endeavor.  If repairs become necessary, then unfortunately, a “BOOM!” will let us know it needs that and we’ll rearrange the kitchen to remove that unit accordingly.

 

That ain’t right either, but that’s the way it is.