Door is leaking steam

[fixbear]

Oven pressure relief or venting sounds like a look see.

 

I should clarify my reasoning.  The oven has a massive door area and gasket. Due to that, I don’t believe it could withstand more the .5 to 1  pound of pressure without a leak.  So that determines that the production of steam exceeds the ability of the oven to condense it or vent it.  The oven is not a pressure vessel, or it would have to be certified as such and go though yearly testing and certification under boiler codes.and have a ISBC tag. So we are down to excessive steam production for the available venting.  Check the condenser and drains for cleanness.  No way a cooking appliance would maintain clean drains for long.

[john]

It’s been some time since this issue was last experienced; is it possible the kitchen staff is mistreating the door in some way? 

 

Also olivero, good to see you again! Welcome back

[olivero]

Hey Fixbear, thanks for the response.

 

I can definetley verify the drains, I am a bit intrigured by this condensate injection you guys were telling me about earlier in this, which is why I revived it. I went looking for the box under the oven, its not obvious. What is the easiest way to find the injection nozzle? Can  I trace it by following one of the solenoid valve hoses to it? Y1 I believe it is?

[olivero]

Hey John,

 

good to see you again as well, been a while.

 

To be honest, the problem never really went away, or it seemed to have for a while but from what I remember the moment they started doing hotter oven temps, the problem reappeared. I definetley think its got something to do with what Fixbear mentioned with the problem of it not being able to get rid of the steam, just logically speaking, the hotter the unit is or the higher above 212*F it is, the more steam it will generate and at a higher rate so I think its just a matter of checking everything and finding the issue once and for all.

[fixbear]

Olivero, what I was getting at is that water at 212 F expands 1700 times from water to steam in volume.  As the temperature rises, it expands much more. I remember that a 1200 lb boiler expansion was like 4300 and that was just like 750 degrees.  So your expansion rate as the oven crosses 350 is probably about 2500.  So one cubic inch of water now becomes 2500 cubic inches of steam. Just under a foot and a half.  Therefore you also need to check the water to the oven orifice and pressure.  (metering system).  Now, when you run that steam threw a water spray,  It condenses down to the original volume plus the spray water.  If to much water is fed into the oven vs. the drain size, venting,  and condensate ability you will build pressure.

 

Now condensing is another precise thing.  They use a very fine fan spray nozzle to cover a lage cross section at 90 degrees to air flow to immediately cool the steam to condensation point.  If the nozzle pattern is not 90 degrees to flow , it’s capacity to condense drops a lot.  I had extensive experience with fan nozzles back in my crop spraying days.  They do wear quickly and calibration changes drastically with as little as a 2 lb pressure change.

 

Hope this theory helps you to decipher it.

[olivero]

Fixbear,

 

Thanks for that theory, I didn’t know water had such a large expansion factor.

 

I did find that little jet and I checked it, figured out how to test it in service and its spraying fine, the spray is definetley fanning out in the drain box. I also checked the drain, it runs water out just fine, does not seem like there is any restriction.

 

I tried adding washers to the door to move the glass out but it doesen’t help, its the same spot as what’s in the pictures above, I think it does it with hot air as well as I can feel the hot air coming out which eventually becomes visible when it steams up.

[fixbear]

Have you checked at what temp the condenser box opens the water valve. Should be 140 F.  Does it stay on?   Is it getting cold water?   Have you ever had a E15 code?  Has the water solenoid for the condenser filter ever been cleaned?   Is the steam generator over firing?  Correct orifice for your altitude, Gas pressure at the burner, Temp sensor.   Ever see water from the steam vent or on the bottom of the oven? 

 

Being this is a chronic continuing condition, You will want to look at all control functions that relate to the steam.  The glass lifting is a over pressure relief.

[olivero]

Good point, I can check these things. Your point of over pressurizing is a good point though, I just checked the install manual and it says the static water pressure has to be 60 PSI or below. Mine is 80 PSI when its running……………………. So that could be it, I’ve seen it with our Bakery oven as it has a steam function, used to almost flood the steam rack because so much water would come out, so I put a PRV on it. Maybe I need to do that with this one.

 

The unit can be running at 350*F and there can be nothing leaking out, its only when its injecting steam it starts leaking and won’t stop until shortly after I hear the water shut off.

 

I also found all the set points Cleveland have on the bypass probe and such, I verified those and they are good.

 

I also spoke to Cleveland and changed the inlet water temp setting as it was set to 60*F whereas, in Florida, its more like 72*F

 

When you say that it opens at a certain temp, what has to be at that temp for it to open? What thing am I measuring to verify that its correct.

 

Also, I just verified it but the jet I checked yesterday is not the one for the condenser box, it sits in the drain, what I thought was Y1 was actually Y2 so I need to check that condenser box, what’s the best way to reach the jet?

[fixbear]

olivero wrote:

 

 

When you say that it opens at a certain temp, what has to be at that temp for it to open? What thing am I measuring to verify that its correct.

 

Also, I just verified it but the jet I checked yesterday is not the one for the condenser box, it sits in the drain, what I thought was Y1 was actually Y2 so I need to check that condenser box, what’s the best way to reach the jet?

Condenser box temp goes to 140 and the spray valve should open. 

3/8 line going into the top of the condenser box at the tee near the temp sensor.

[olivero]

Okay cool, so how do I access the jet? Do I pull the fitting out with the tubing on it or is there a way to reach inside the condenser box and remove the jet?