Carpigiani rewire 230V to 400V 3 phase

[fixbear]

okwestern, I have a few questions for you.

1 do you mean 480 volts, or is this in a different continent than north America.

2 Is this a batch Gellato machine that requires 3 KW of power?

3, How long has it been in service?

I ask all this due to the cost of conversion.  I’m thinking you might be better served by either replacing the machine on a trade in or installing a  transformer to power it.  I do believe that the transformer option would be the most cost effective.  Your looking at replacing the control power transformer, contactor, compressor, and mix motor.  Also if it has pasteurization heat, you may need to replace the heater.  Definitely getting up too more than 50% of a new machine.

[coffeegeek]

1) I think we have something called TN-system (Terra Neutral) in Norway. This was marked 380V in the old days. 
2) The machine is in storage until we move to the new location, but I want to be prepared for relocation as we don’t have much time to fool around with the machine when we get the keys.

A Labo 1420M manual says “3 phase 200 or 380V, 2kW”, but I’m not sure if this is the same model year as mine, looks similar though.

3) We bought it used, so we don’t know.

I see.

If the mix motor is a 230/400V (rewiring from delta to star wiring takes care of that).

I have wholesale purchase accounts so I get high quality contactors for about $20-25. Power transformers are also relatively cheap.

The compressor is another story. Replacing and refilling will be around $600.

Out of curiosity, how much is a Carpigiani with same capacity as the Labo 1420M?

[fixbear]

Didn’t realize you were in Norway.  That explains a lot.  Also with your Varimixer.

You may best be served by calling Carpigiana on this.  As for cost, that varies country by country.  I think they are about $4000 here, but I’ve never seen one as the frozen custard machines are popular here.  A low temp compressor of that HP would cost about $1200 or more to replace here. That model isn’t even in Partstowns system.  So I’m just guessing on that.  I don’t have any knowledge of your electrical codes in Norway, so I’m at a disadvantage on ways that are acceptable to do a work around.  I have done several equipment moves to a new building that I had to install a transformer and a sub panel to supply several machines.

[fixbear]

I just realized that that means you are also 50 cycle

[coffeegeek]

I’ll have to take a look at the compressor when I have the machine. I’m sure there are economical substitutes for the compressor with same specs. A transformer this size will probably be $7-800?

Yes, we’re at 50 Hz.

[fixbear]

A set of 3,  5 KVA buck boost would only be less than $400 here.

[coffeegeek]

You don’t happen to have the service manual for the Carpigiani? Or any other one (I guess many of them are quite similar)?

[fixbear]

The closest thing I can find on you model is the operation and install manuals. The equipment they market here is built for here by a company they bought out due to the vast differences in electrical codes  https://www.machineryworld.com/pdfs/Carpigiani/Carpigiani-Labo-Manual.pdf

They guard their service manuals, so you’ll need to contact them for more.

[fixbear]

Just so you know,  They were Cold-A-Lite here before the merge.  I still believe them to be the best soft serve machine.

[coffeegeek]

I can’t seem to get my replies posted. Maybe too big images?

[coffeegeek]

Now it allowed at least one post… I’ll try to upload the images in the next post.

I finally got around to open the machine. Seems the compressor has a separate motor (blue motor, see picture) which can be either star or delta wired so it is definitely 230/400V interchangeable.

Same goes for the beater motor (green motor, see picture). I’m not sure how this is connected since the terminal board doesn’t have a star nor delta connection(?). Shouldn’t there be bridges on the terminal board (I’m new to wiring these motors)?

The solenoid coil (light blue Danfoss 018Z) is 230V.

It seems to have a timer(?) in the front. Also 230V.

Contactors, ABB B12-30-10 probably has 230V coils (although contacts might be rated for 400V, they usually are). And most times the coils are replaceable.

According to the schematics, it should also have three overload protections and a pressostat (they all might already be rated for 400V), and a fan motor (MV) which probably is 230V.

As far as I can identify, these are the only components depending on power.

If both motors can be simply re-wired to star configuration, then only solenoid coil (7-8 EUR), timer (unknown, but this can be cheaply replaced with a China digital one), contractors (I get them for 18 EUR a piece – but maybe the coils can be purchased separately, even cheaper) and fan (8-15 EUR) needs to be replaced.

Any thoughts about a full 400V re-build?

I’m also considering this 400->230V:

https://www.banggood.com/5_5KW-380V-3-Phase-VFD-Variable-Frequency-Drive-Inverter-Motor-Speed-Controller-p-1303435.html

[coffeegeek]

first batch